Jump to content
Beautiful Sunday
Sign in to follow this  
gorilla

Albion Rovers v The Binos

Recommended Posts

13 minutes ago, Buster said:

Sorry but i’ve just watched Nicoll’s sending off and that’s a straight Red for me and I would be shouting for it if it was the opposite way around. There is no doubt the intent is to win the ball, but he comes in with a straight leg and I just can’t see it any other way 🙈

https://mobile.twitter.com/colinwoodward/status/1167896074821877760?s=07

Yep, you're right Buster, couldn't see that from my behind the goal position. He is going for the ball, but studs up and that's a red. If that was the only disputed incident fair enough, but it wasn't. You can judge for yourself on the highlights.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hard to argue but I absolutely guarantee we’l see numerous identical challenges go unpunished this season & many which are a worse.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Craigy said:

Hard to argue but I absolutely guarantee we’l see numerous identical challenges go unpunished this season & many which are a worse.

 

Including one Iv just watched on MOTD which was ok’d After Var! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Craigy said:

Including one Iv just watched on MOTD which was ok’d After Var! 

Thinking exactly the same thing.  A much worse tackle by tielemans on Willson. 

I guess nicols reputation means he wont get the benefit of the doubt in these situations 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, BinoBalls said:

Usually the club Twitter has a statement from the manager after each game. But nothing tonight. It’s all gone a bit quiet. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Buster said:

Sorry but i’ve just watched Nicoll’s sending off and that’s a straight Red for me and I would be shouting for it if it was the opposite way around. There is no doubt the intent is to win the ball, but he comes in with a straight leg and I just can’t see it any other way 🙈

https://mobile.twitter.com/colinwoodward/status/1167896074821877760?s=07

Fully agree. KR said in his post match interview that neither were reds, for me that one it(not sure about other). 

Also what happens with a manager red card. Are they given a touchline ban? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, chuckitphilliben said:

Looking at some footage of the handball incident on twitter I can see why a penalty was given under the new rules but the decision to show a red card is utterly baffling. 

I thought that @chuckitphilliben but having read this article, because the shot was going to be on target (i’m guessing from the footage on Twitter) then the Ref has seemed that as preventing a goal scoring opportunity and has used that to issue the red. Not saying I agree with it, but it looks like the ref was implementing the new laws.

https://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/how-does-the-new-handball-rule-work-football-rules-explained/baj7pi2kk191qyeu9ay8wlrn

Edited by Buster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So logically any handball from a shot in the box should warrant a red card because if you are in the box and shooting that is clearly a goal scoring opportunity.  I look forward to a slew of penalties and red cards in forthcoming weeks. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Craigy said:

I made this point during the game. Wonder if Rutkiewicz might register himself to offer cover? We had 3 out today and our two guys who can fill in there were sent off! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, cold light of day analysis. Watched both R’s loads of times. 

Nicoll.  Still think a Y would’ve sufficed. Don’t think there would’ve been many complaints if it was Y. But - there are quite a few of us on fb & forum who think that it was a justified R. So - our options split, call down to ref’s opinion - got to conclude that ref did NOT get that one badly wrong.

McLean. Many of us are saying “pen -yes, fair enough... but R - no chance”. That analysis is WRONG in terms if the Laws.

 

1st Question for ref: is it a foul? Most of us on here & fb are accepting it was. TBH, I’m still not sure. If McLean’s arm was beside his body & not outstretched, then there’s no offence & should be play-on. 

 If we accept that it his arm was outstretched then it . Most of us saying it was - so, ref did NOT make an obvious error on that one either. 

 Next key question (for ref) is: did McLean deny an obvious goal scoring opportunity? That’s a matter of interpretation (not fact) - but, when the shot is fired towards goal from that distance, then it’s pretty difficult to argue it wasn’t an obvious goal scoring opportunity. If you accept that, then a R card is mandatory - that wasn’t a ref’s choice, he had to give it. 

If you refuse to accept it was an obvious g/s opp (& I cant see why anyone can conclude that), then a Y would’ve been correct. 

Again, though, have to conclude that the ref did NOT get that decision badly wrong.

Yes, there were other incidents. But I thought at least one of the ‘last man tackles’ was a brilliant tackle & others round about me agreed. Again, NOT an obvious refereeing error.

Would like to see Jardine incident again - feeling at the time, from my angle behind the goal was it was Y

But, overall, cold light of day - I wouldn’t say that the ref got any of the BIG decisions wrong. Not what I was shouting at the time (or at FT)  but I now think that a fair & reasonable analysis concludes that we weren’t beaten by bad refereeing yesterday. 

PS I thought his lack of Man management skills in the KR R decision was disgraceful. But not a game-influencer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Genuine question

How can a shot in the box be anything other than a goal scoring opportunity given that the whole point of the game is to score goals and that shooting in the box is far and away the most likely way of that happening?

Genuine other question

What possible circumstances could exist where an unnatural silhouette is not deliberate? (outside those already covered in the post as per @Buster above or St Vitus dance)

My conclusion is that every shot in the box that hits someone on the hand or arm where the referee deems the player to have made his silhouette unnaturally larger requires both a penalty and a red card as it is deliberate handball denying a goal scoring opportunity.

Let's just see that applied consistently

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, chuckitphilliben said:

How can a shot in the box be anything other than a goal scoring opportunity given that the whole point of the game is to score goals and that shooting in the box is far and away the most likely way of that happening?

Open to interpretation & ref's opinion, so will always be variances. Factors which will form that opinion include those I set out in my post: where was shot taken from? direction of travel? goal bound or not? speed of ball. Take all those into account, then form an opinion. 

Also - you've missed out a key word, i.e. "obvious". Not enough to be a goal-scoring opportunity; it has to be obvious. Not what I was shouting yesterday - & the youtube clip is still not conclusive, but IMO, that AR had an obviously g/s opportunity denied by McLean's handball (IF you accept it was a handball)

As we both know, not all of our shots at goal are goal bound!! So there are loads of examples of shooting in the box where, if you apply above criteria, you'll conclude it wasn't an obvious g/s opp.

This sounds a bit flippant - don't mean to be - but objective in cricket is to knock over the stumps, but not every ball bowled is obviously gonna hit them. Parallel argument in football surely? Not every shot a goal is obviously gonna go into the goal.

16 minutes ago, chuckitphilliben said:

What possible circumstances could exist where an unnatural silhouette is not deliberate?

The 'silhouette' bit is a load of shite made up by "pundits" who haven't a scooby what they're talking about. But because they say it in the media, fans hook into it & think it must be right. It's not! The Laws don't mention anything about silhouette. The key Law wording about yesterday's incident is around "the arm has made the body unnaturally bigger". Ref yesterday obviously thought that's what Paul McLean did. Personally, I'm not convinced on that one - but, increasingly, refs are all interpreting it the way yesterday's ref did. 

But, as I said in my post, there's an argument to be had both ways. There's no way any of us can sensibly conclude (as I certainly did yesterday) that he was absolutely wrong & made a blunder. That's just not true.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I was watching the WWC over the summer where the new handball rule was used I remember saying something along the lines of 'well league 2 is going to be fun next season'

Quod erat demonstrandum  

I still think he made a blunder on the handball but the fact that others are supporting the ref strengthens your case I guess. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If anybody here has ever tried to jump in a game of football without their arms coming up to some degree, I'd like to know how they did it, as it's a natural involuntary balance response. This rule is pure pants. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Darth Bino said:

If anybody here has ever tried to jump in a game of football without their arms coming up to some degree, I'd like to know how they did it, as it's a natural involuntary balance response. This rule is pure pants. 

Pogo Stick?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Darth Bino said:

If anybody here has ever tried to jump in a game of football without their arms coming up to some degree, I'd like to know how they did it, as it's a natural involuntary balance response. This rule is pure pants. 

We’re starting to get into the Michael Stewart biomechanics land now........but you’re right.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Mr grumpy said:

What’s the record for red cards by a team? Does the SPFL punish the club for poor discipline?

36 in Argentina in one game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Buster said:

Not saying I agree with it, but it looks like the ref was implementing the new laws.

Yup

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Buster said:

I thought that @chuckitphilliben but having read this article, because the shot was going to be on target (i’m guessing from the footage on Twitter) then the Ref has seemed that as preventing a goal scoring opportunity and has used that to issue the red. Not saying I agree with it, but it looks like the ref was implementing the new laws.

https://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/how-does-the-new-handball-rule-work-football-rules-explained/baj7pi2kk191qyeu9ay8wlrn

Where then is the consistency? Why was our man not sent off when the first penalty was awarded weeks ago?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...